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The nature of paint

Hand Lettering topics: Sign Making, Design, Fabrication, Letterheads, Sign Books.

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Steven Vigeant
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:07 am
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The nature of paint

Post by Steven Vigeant »

I've been kicking around several paint questions for a few years. Perhaps there are several answers and you know I'm going to broadcast them once I hear them (and I like to credit any and all sources), but I'd love to get some feedback on a handful of paint mysteries from those who know.

1 Does waterbourne enamel fade faster than oil-enamel? or is it more chalk resistant?
Does latex housepaint weather better than sign paints?
Does enamel with flattener hold up well? Is it advisable to depend on flattener?
2 How is it possible to get a good background with waterbourne that doesn't look lappy and flashy? Can we use Flo-trol?
3 Is there a way to speed up the dry time of latex?
4 What's the best way to speed the drying of Smith's cream? If it's japan dryer does it weaken a finish?
5 Can you use Liberon metallics on a store window or exterior sign?
6 Does the new One-Shot dry slow or what? Always seems to need hardener.

Well there is a short list, I hope that isn't too many questions for starters.
Thanks
Tony Segale
Posts: 702
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:20 am

Post by Tony Segale »

Mr. Schofield...

I'm going to answer a few of those for you per experience...
90% of all my sign and mural work is now produced with only Benjamin Moore premium quality exterior acrylic latex...
outlasts 10-1...my last few signs produced with oil based enamels were fading in 2-3 years. After the switch to BM,
signs painted five years ago look as good as the day they were installed, and yes, a couple do have 23K gilded letters.
Lappy or flashy background? My only suggestion would be not to apply paint in hot, direct sunlight.
Work as if you were a house painter. Would you paint in the sun on a 90 degree or above day? I would wait for early morning shade or afternoon.
If it is inside the shop, I don't know how you can get a lappy or flashy background. It's a question of speed, son.
With latex, lay the paint down evenly with as few passes as necessary to do so. I never use Floe-trol, some do, I don't.
To me, it's not necessary, if you know the rules. One suggestion, if you have a few different containers open to work with at once,
keep a water spray bottle handy to mist the top of each, occasionally, to keep from drying.
Yes, you will have to double coat, but that's very easy...if you let the first coat dry. If you lay the second coat down and it lifts paint from the first, it's too soon.
I apply a first coat to all areas I want to work on that day. The next day, hit 'em again, you'll find this second coat as easy as squashin a wormy apple.
Speed up the dry time to latex? Why are you in such a hurry? Easy, Schofield, easy. The first thing an artist needs to learn is take things easy.
The best way to speed up the dry time is to take a break and go do something else. Don't the train stop?

When working with oil enamels and Smith's Cream, I always know what I'm working with and plan accordingly.
Therefor, there's know reason to speed the drying, just create my blend and go do something else.
When working in reverse glass, always let your blended colors dry overnight (again per my experience / mistakes).
If you back up the blended colors to soon, the new color will blend in and show throught the face side of the glass.
Try that on a large storefront window if you don't believe me.
Go on then.

Mr. Jenko
and he took that golden hair and made a sweater for baby bear.
http://www.tonysegale.com
http://www.tonysegale.wordpress.com
Steven Vigeant
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:07 am
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Riddle this

Post by Steven Vigeant »

Mr Jenko,
Does that mean your still looking for a home for all of that oil enamel and hardener left over from that meet way back when? I think it was in the town where the Golden Bear has a sweater of fiberglass hair. At a time when the poet Blake helped with the Butler's work. When we discovered that weeding vinyl for 2 days in the wind wasn't all that bad since we got to be real Walldogs at least for a long weekend. And it became patently clear that Gentleman Jay was better off borrowing golf-carts than 150hp Hogs, even though it made him an easier water-balloon target for any ol' grandpa. I seem to remember it was around the time we discovered that jackhammers are unnecessary for breaking open bank parking lots when there is plenty of hardener on the ground. And we were thanked for our trouble with a glorious weenie roast! Where was that again?
Thanks for the reply. The train doesn't seem to stop for me.
Mr. Schofield
Last edited by Steven Vigeant on Fri May 16, 2008 2:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
Doug Bernhardt
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Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 9:29 am
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Post by Doug Bernhardt »

well heres another few cents worth. 1 Why use Smith's cream and one-shot. It's a great additive for japans but with one shot I've been using linseed oil (an idea I got from Studden some years ago) with great success. 2 One shot has changed alot. Black used to dry in a couple hours and now it needs over night. A month or so back an old friend dropped off a few old cans of one squirt and I couldn't believe how heavy they were by comparison. 3. driers can be a huge problem. I know they recommend to use only a drop to add to artist oil colours. There.....now lets see how others add to this.
Steven Vigeant
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Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:07 am
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Post by Steven Vigeant »

Some questions Doug
What do you do with japans with or without Smith's? I'm having trouble finding out specifics about the traditional uses of japan color.
Your success with linseed oil is with blending I assume?
What are the paint layers and additives you put on one of your exterior painted wood signs these days and how does it compare with the traditional way I assume you learned from Harry Koffman?
Doug Bernhardt
Posts: 1077
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 9:29 am
Location: Ottawa Canada
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Post by Doug Bernhardt »

Hi Steven....so surprised to hear old HK's name mentioned. He was my hero. As for the Japans I use them on glass projects although the odd use in other places happens too. They see alot of use in finishing furniture (I hear)and there's a good book available from Fine Woodworking on that. Yes the linseed oil is for blending BUT it (one shot) has a beautiful tough film on it when dry....next day or sooner depending on the colour. As to what I'm up to, finishing wise, is pretty much how I learned from Harry and others. 2 oil primers a coat of white (sort of) gloss and final sanding 360 grit and paint away. Start with things like blended shades and ribbons and I cut in everything around those messier items/parts. Clearcoat either star coating or Mann Bros..... size and gild. Occasionally I'll add some hardener to a colour if I need it to dry faster. I have a few of those on my website in the painted signs portion. I have to get it together when it comes to posting photos here although I also admit to being on the shy side as well. Hope that equals an nickels worth now ;=)
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