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Glue Chip Cabinet

Hand Lettering topics: Sign Making, Design, Fabrication, Letterheads, Sign Books.

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Chris Lovelady
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Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:37 pm
Location: Tallahassee, Florida
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Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Chris Lovelady »

when in art school in denver in the mid 80's i learned glue chipping and haven't done it since. i even have a half completed project that is all blasted from then i have been carrying around. i want to do it again but i live in North Florida and the humidity is crazy high. i read about the process here under Rick Glawson and he mentioned plans for a booth that you would hook a dehumidifier up to help the chipping. i cannot seem to locate the plans for that and was wondering if any one here might have built one or might share some picture or plans for it.

Lovelady
Ron Berlier
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Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 3:27 am

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Ron Berlier »

Ron Berlier
Wherever I go, there I am.
Chris Lovelady
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Location: Tallahassee, Florida
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Chris Lovelady »

it seems that cam bortz and John Parker was talking at the Danville wall dog meet about a dehumidifier attached to the box has any one done this.

thanks for the link.


Lovelady
Roderick Treece
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Roderick Treece »

If and when I find a small affordable dihumidifier I will place it right inside my box. Right now I am useing about 12 small plastic disicant cups from home depot.I all so have a tub of it thats larger.It will get it down to 18%
Mike Jackson
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Mike Jackson »

When I was at one of the Conclaves, Rick had one of those dehumidifiers for making jerky and dried fruit on a shelf. He tried chipping small pieces in it. From what I remember, the results weren't great, but you still might be able to put one of them inside a chip booth to speed up the process of removing the moisture in the air.

Good luck,
Mike Jackson
Mike Jackson / co-administrator
Golden Era Studios
Vintage Ornamental Clip art
Jackson Hole, WY

Photography site:
Teton Images
Jackson Hole photography blog:
Best of the Tetons
DAVE SMITH
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Location: ENGLAND

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by DAVE SMITH »

Hi Chris.
I also live by the coast and have found the best way to chip glass is on a lightbox .I use mine as a bench when not using it for the chipping.
I find it more reliable than the cabinet design.
Dave
Last edited by DAVE SMITH on Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
erik winkler
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by erik winkler »

I have seen it work and Dave is the master.
He knows...
Realizing we are in the 2nd renaissance of the arts.
Learn, copy and trying to improve...
Still in the learning phase ;-)
Amsterdam Netherlands
www.ferrywinkler.nl
www.schitterend.eu
www.facebook.com/Schitterend.eu
Roderick Treece
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Roderick Treece »

Doug Bernhardt
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Doug Bernhardt »

There was a thread here somewhere and couldn't find it. This is my version of Smitty's light table and worked like a dream right from the get go. I'd try not to over complicate all this...is simple and works first time. The table also doubles for a work surface most of the time.
e-chipping table1.jpg
e-chipping table1.jpg (89.23 KiB) Viewed 17403 times
Chris Lovelady
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Chris Lovelady »

ok so i have a light table from a home made silkscreen light table i built years ago and hadn't the heart to dismantle it, i think now i know why,.... me talking over my shoulder to the wife, "see i told you it would come in handy some day!" looks like i will be bringing it out of the barn and putting it back to use.

i am a little slow so i will ask a few questions...so you place your glass on top of the glass of the light table to warm the glass? i thought the chipping glass should be at at a certain temp. or does it go inside the table to have more control over the environment. i am sure i will have to remodel what i have to make it work. please more info on this light table.

I see how the cost of a big commercial dehumidifier is not cost effective. i remember growing up and mom had one that was small and worked in the bedroom when we were sick, looking into that. hmmm i have a food dehydrator and it works by low heat and air flow i think the light bulbs and a small fan would do that trick. do you use florescent bulbs, standard light bulbs or something that heats more. i don't want to seem ignorant about this as i have done it before but it was a life time ago and it was in Denver...dry, no need for a booth. putting it out side in the sun here is some times iffy when the fast moving scattered shower comes through. i want to do it right the first time...so if you folks will bear with me i will ask bunch more questions.

Lovelady
Jerry Berg
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Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 3:17 pm
Location: pacific northwest

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Jerry Berg »

Chris,

The box will use regular flourecent tubes. Place your piece flat on the top. You can elevate your piece off of the light table glass, maybe 1/4 inch using wood or plex pieces on the corners.

Jerry
Patrick Mackle
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Patrick Mackle »

If you don't have the extra scratch to buy a dehumidifier, you can use an old air conditioner. An air conditioner's condensation coils pass more cubic air over them than a humidifier and are even colder. The important thing in both appliances is to capture the water run off from the coil and collect it in a restricted container so that the captured condensed moisture can't re-evaporate back into the air space you are drying.
I bought two Hampton Bay air conditioners several years ago at Home Depot on sale for $99.00 each to use in a drying room for drying photo resist.
I also have an early Graingers dehumidifier that is still working. I bought it back in 1982 for glue chipping. I actually found that I did not need to use ANY refrigerated drying devices to do glue chipping. Just a simple heat source from a cheap portable bathroom heater with a little fan in it does the job. I had a 5' X 6' metal lawn mower shed set up in my garage. In it I built a wooden "harp rack" to hold up to 35 glass panels upright, 1 1/2" apart. In the afternoon I would apply the glue to the panels and place them down wind from a gentle breeze from a box fan. Then later when the glue was dried to a transparent rubbery state (like nagahyde when pressed into with a finger nail) I would stand the panels in the harp rack, turn on the bathroom heater and go to bed. In the morning all the glue would be chipped. Some flakes that happened to be barely attached would sweep away with a paint brush taking others below with them. I would gather them up to reuse them. This system worked whether it was a sunny California day, or in the middle of a week long rain storm with water coming in under the garage door. That observation gave me a great insight into the mechanics of the glue, as well as how the glue is able to chip the glass with different patterns.
Pat
Anthony Bennett
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Anthony Bennett »

DAVE SMITH wrote:Hi Chris.
I also live by the coast and have found the best way to chip glass is on a lightbox .I use mine as a bench when not using it for the chipping.
I find it more reliable than the cabinet design.
Dave
Dave, How does bench enclose the glass please. or are you saying the light source comes from underneath and the glass is left open to the elements?
DAVE SMITH
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by DAVE SMITH »

Anthony.
Like you see in Dougs pick of his light table the glass sits on top of the lightbox. The lights are inside with one big panel of glass ontop.
I glue up the glass let it sit for about an hour on a the table without the lights on then lift the glass onto some raised paper cups.
Now turn on the lights and the table (glass)will heat up to the temprature of around 100 dgs my humidity will fall to around 20% the glass if you touch it will be the same
degree of heat as if the sun was out and shinning on the piece. I remember chipping outside when I first started reverse glass and the sun always did a good job of my panels until cloud over. you don't want cloud over.... After about 3-4 hours put the glass directly down on the light table (glass) the glue would have started to dry and gone past the stage of melting back to a runny consistancy,(reamulsify) something like that.... now leave the glass for around 10-15 hours theres no rush just leave it,you will get a nice chip pattern everytime. If you want to create the snail chip just prevent it from drying by leaving it somewhere cold over night even somewhere damp works well then once it is dry chuck it on that light table and watch those snails jump off that sucker.....

Goodluck ..

Dave
Doug Bernhardt
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Doug Bernhardt »

It's worth mentioning that I have six (yes count 'em) 6 bulbs in my table and it's just an old illuminated sign that was messed with. Before this I tried many other methods and the best reults were a old radiator heated shop in the winter....that is followed closely by this. I was probably very lucky in so far as I never had an issue with chipping glass. I also listened and watched carefully and saw Rick Glawson's set-up in action as well. Judging by the results of this simple light-table it also was over complicated. Fans were never intended to work in those temperatures and would break down etc etc etc. The big commercial chipping shops/glass specialty shops have perfect set-ups that are as Pat mentions, perfectly controlled conditions which are no doubt perfect for what they require. I do this just a few times a year now BUT do want it to work on schedule with the job. Pour the glue.....Turn the lights on and by the time I get there in the morning it's about finished.
e-Chipping Booth.jpg
e-Chipping Booth.jpg (78.97 KiB) Viewed 17226 times
This is another chipping booth that never worked
coline
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:07 am
Location: Mallow, Ireland

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by coline »

Hi everyone,
im new at this and trying out things at home, i dont have a real big workshop like you guys, and i dont have work i do it for my own pleasure for now. im about to try glue chipping on a piece and i've been thinking about how to dry the glue for few weeks now, an idea came just tell me straight out if im stupid, but how about leaving it in the hot press for a couple of days? living in ireland the hot press is where you have your water tank, it would be the driest and warmest place i could think of. i dont have fancy gear and i yet have to find a sandblaster with a small unit to sandblast my glass, but is it worth the try or am i just going to waste my glass? not a hope in looking for sun here....
i wish i was in the states everything seems so much more available there or at least in England where Dave is (big fan).
i see everybody's work here and dream of learning from ye, i'd be too shy to show my own work but maybe one day i'll get to meet some of you.
Dave are you doing any more workshops??

one more question what glue do you use to stick abalone onto glass?
thanks lads
Coline
Mike Jackson
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Mike Jackson »

Coline,
I am all about doing tests when learning something new. In your case, try buying some 12" squares (any size is okay) and doing half a dozen or dozen with a very simple design. You could do all of them the same or experiment with a couple of the variables and then put a few in different places for chipping, including the hot press area. You'll get a lot of answers! Probably the most important issue for you initially will be getting the right glue.

Good luck,
Mike Jackson
Mike Jackson / co-administrator
Golden Era Studios
Vintage Ornamental Clip art
Jackson Hole, WY

Photography site:
Teton Images
Jackson Hole photography blog:
Best of the Tetons
DAVE SMITH
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Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 11:12 am
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by DAVE SMITH »

Hello Coline.
I am having a Gold workshop in November if you are interested, also Feb and April 2011. I also now teach them on a one-to-one workshop to a specific date of your own.
Dave
Anthony Bennett
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Anthony Bennett »

DAVE SMITH wrote:Hello Coline.
I am having a Gold workshop in November if you are interested, also Feb and April 2011. I also now teach them on a one-to-one workshop to a specific date of your own.
Dave

Dave, I would love to come onto one of your free workshops :D
CAn you book me in for Feb?
Thanks for the explanation on your light box, I had got it into my head that you used a lid to keep the "snails" in one place.
Tony Segale
Posts: 702
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:20 am

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Tony Segale »

yeah, me, too.
and he took that golden hair and made a sweater for baby bear.
http://www.tonysegale.com
http://www.tonysegale.wordpress.com
erik winkler
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by erik winkler »

When is my date Dave?
Realizing we are in the 2nd renaissance of the arts.
Learn, copy and trying to improve...
Still in the learning phase ;-)
Amsterdam Netherlands
www.ferrywinkler.nl
www.schitterend.eu
www.facebook.com/Schitterend.eu
DAVE SMITH
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Location: ENGLAND

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by DAVE SMITH »

You boys can come anytime. I just need notice....

manic Dave trying to find them snails...
erik winkler
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by erik winkler »

I am very flexible and do not want to use too much of your time.
Realizing we are in the 2nd renaissance of the arts.
Learn, copy and trying to improve...
Still in the learning phase ;-)
Amsterdam Netherlands
www.ferrywinkler.nl
www.schitterend.eu
www.facebook.com/Schitterend.eu
Leo Calleros
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Leo Calleros »

Mr Dave Smith, I have not been to England in years but I surely would return for one of your work shops.
BruceJackson
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by BruceJackson »

Did I read "FREE" workshop....Good on you Dave! That's very generous or you.
I want to come to that freebie too....hahaha.....looking forward to the free beer and free lunch.

Coline, Don't be shy about showing your work. I think we all feel a bit that way, especially when you see some of the some of the excellent work on display.

But really, even very accomplished artisans with decades of experience are often humble about their work and feel there is still much to learn. We are all learning and get inspired and enriched by other people. Even raw beginners bring something new and seeing through their fresh outlook can often open up new ideas.

As for the Abalone question. It seems to me you can use lots of different glue for this. At various times, I've tried or read about people using instant glue (supaglue), epoxy, UV cured, PVA (water-based wood glue that dries clear) or just plain old gold size. I'm not sure what other people are using now but they may have a good reason for suggesting one particular solution.

Seems the main criteria is that it is optically clear, which isn't hard to achieve when it is such a thin layer of glue. Some cheap epoxies can change colour, but you also can buy them very clear and long lasting. I like one called "Enviro-tex", although it is very slow to dry. Be careful when using instant glue, as it will affect the appearance of any matt-gilded areas if they are adjacent to the shell.
Anthony Bennett
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Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by Anthony Bennett »

I'm only two hours up the road from you Dave.
Once I have saved up the money tp pay for the petrol......... :D
coline
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Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:07 am
Location: Mallow, Ireland

Re: Glue Chip Cabinet

Post by coline »

Hey,
thanks lads for answering my questions, must experiment. Dave im delighted to hear that and will contact you regarding november workshop.
Coline

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