One of my old sign kits

[Ray Smith]

Now that I can post pictures here I thought I would put up a couple of pictures of an old sign kit I acquired several months ago.Made by the George E.Watson co. of Chicago it came to me as shown.Most of the brushes in it also have the Watson label imprinted on them.The mahl stick is in excellent shape and still has the original end.
Mike had provided me with a catalog imprint of this kit which seems to date around 1925 and if the description is accurate,the kit is missing only a couple of items(the brush holder and two of the four solvent cans as far as I can determine).
I have used several of the brushes from the kit and they still seem to function well except for some hair loss on one of them.
I am assembling a small collection of vintage sign kits and spray equipment(air brushes and spray guns of various types)and also have a vintage striping tool made by DeVilbiss of the same(1925)era.Always enjoy seeing pictures of old equipment and wondering of the stories they could tell. Enjoy.

[Kelly Thorson]

Were there a lot of extra brushes in the kit, seems like a lot?
I love old things, and I agree about all the stories that are likely tied up in that one box.
What a treasure. Thanks for sharing the pics.

[Ray Smith]

Were there a lot of extra brushes in the kit, seems like a lot?
I love old things, and I agree about all the stories that are likely tied up in that one box.
What a treasure. Thanks for sharing the pics.

Kelly:
There were two different types of lettering brushes;the brown handled and the black handled.The brown handled ones were numbered 1 to 12;the numbers on the black ones were illegible.Some of the other brushes were a DaVoe and Raynolds(same as the brown handles),several marked simply,"France"and a couple of Grumbachers marked,"Bavaria".The tiny quills work really nice;not sure what he used them for but you can do incredibly small work with them.
One of the mystery pieces(at least to me and nearly everyone I have showed it to)is the small cut glass cup.It has concave sides and the top is covered with layers of what appears to be remnants of gold and silver leaf.It appears to have seen many years of use.Somebody theorized it may have been used to hold water sizing but the size(maybe 1 fluid oz.)wouldn't seem to bear out that idea.
When I began the process of cleaning out the brushes to determine if they were still good(I only found 3 that were beyond using)there seemed to be a metallic powder coating the preservative(which I assume was the Vaseline that was in the bottom).Since there was no evidence of any metallic powder in the box(or the Vaseline)I am curious as to what this may have been.Whatever it was,it washed out rather readily.
I would love to know who originally owned it.I thought I may have had a lead when talking with an old friend and fellow striper who lived in California.When I was telling him about it,he mentioned that he was working in Chicago back in the early 70's and met a sign artist who had a kit almost identical and was retiring and moving to California;ironically to the same area as where I purchased the kit!He is still looking for the guy's name but the chances of finding it aren't too promising.
The person I got it from has no clue who owned it and purchased it at an estate sale in his home town.
The other kit I got at least has a history which I am currently researching further.I got that one from the sign artist's grandson.Pictures to follow.

[Kelly Thorson]

Thanks Ray, you answered a couple of the questions I wondered but didn't ask too.
I'd love to discover something like that for myself!

[Kent Smith]

The glass cup may have been used for size. Dad used to cook his size in a larger pot and then used a small cup for gilding which he refilled as he went. The Vasaleline may have been used to charge the gilder's tip and the brushes were oiled with lard oil. The lard oil attracts bronze and laminum powder like crazy which if there was none in the kit when you got it, there probably was at one time. Lard oil also cleans out of the brushes very completely, even after many years. I always had the small quills for some tight oulines, lettering "Member FDIC" and most importantly, "Smith Sign Studio" at the lower edge of an inscription, really small. We had a couple of Watson kits but I never cared for the fold-out style, preferring drawers.

Thanks for the memories.

[Dan Beach]

Hello everyone. I've been lurking here for awhile now, and I must say a lot of the glass etching/guilding stuff goes WAY over my head. I hope to eventually learn that stuff though. You guys definitely put out some fantastic work.

I am interested in acquiring an old sign kit. I was wondering what the fair market value would be for this:



Direct link: http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w123 ... CF8564.jpg

I am really close to buying these brushes, but I want to make sure I'm not making a mistake.

Thanks for any input.

[Ray Smith]

The glass cup may have been used for size. Dad used to cook his size in a larger pot and then used a small cup for gilding which he refilled as he went. The Vasaleline may have been used to charge the gilder's tip and the brushes were oiled with lard oil. The lard oil attracts bronze and laminum powder like crazy which if there was none in the kit when you got it, there probably was at one time. Lard oil also cleans out of the brushes very completely, even after many years. I always had the small quills for some tight oulines, lettering "Member FDIC" and most importantly, "Smith Sign Studio" at the lower edge of an inscription, really small. We had a couple of Watson kits but I never cared for the fold-out style, preferring drawers.

Thanks for the memories.

Thank YOU for the input Kent.I had brought the kit to Chicago to show a couple of friends and it was their opinion also that it was probably used for size.The concave surface makes it rather easy to hold between the fingers and the pressed glass design keeps it from slipping.
Now that you mention it,it probably was lard oil that was in the brushes as it did clean out rather readily.didn't notice any aroma from them,but who knows how long they have been sitting.
At first I thought the residue might be particles of leaf but they were too consistent in size.
The fold out shelves are really a bit of a pain as access to parts of them are limited due to the rolled edge and overhang from the shelf above.The compartment dividers are also loose(don't appear to ever have been tacked down)and brushes and such move around under them creating problems.Also if there isn't a lot of weight in the bottom,when all the shelves(and the front flap)are opened,the box will tip over.
I don't intend it to be a using box(I have several others that work just fine)but rather something to admire and wonder about it's history.AH! If they could only talk!

To Dan:A welcome to the forum.As to what the brushes pictured would be worth:Not to be a wiseguy but somewhere between what the seller is asking and what you are willing to pay.That is what determines the worth of anything.
It looks to be quite a selection of brushes;probably more than you can ever use in a lifetime.What the condition of the brushes are is another story entirely.If you are(or are considering becoming)a sign artist by profession,then they would probably be a good investment.
For the sake of the argument;assuming that the AVERAGE(and this is a lowball figure)price of a lettering brush is $5,count up the number of brushes that are in the kit and multiply by five.This will give you a rough figure of what they would cost for you to go out and purchase them new.Again for the sake of argument;if you figure that a good used brush might be worth 2/3rds of that,then use a figure of three as a multiplier.You should also probably add a bit for the brush boxes.This will give you a figure to work with.You then ask if you are willing to spend that amount.If this figure is drastically lower than what the person is asking for them,you canthen decide whether to offer that sum or not.
Just my thoughts.

[Ray Smith]

Thanks to all who commented.Here are some pictures of another old kit I acquired a couple years ago.This kit belonged to a man named Carl J.Stoiber who started his career as a striper for the Willys-Overland Co. of Toledo Ohio.I have a picture of him and his family at work there taken around 1920.
Subsequently he went into business as a sign artist in the Toledo area until sometime in the 1940's.He is listed in a Toledo business directory of 1937.
I acquired the kit from his grandson who discovered it while cleaning out his father's garage after he had passed away.It was received in trade for a striping and lettering job on his Corvette.
The brushes were very stiff and he had apparently used lacquer in them as there were several cans of it in the kit that were made by the Mountain Varnish and Color Works of New York,Chicago,and Toledo.So far I haven't been able to find any information on the company.I very carefully cleaned them by soaking them in acetone for a short time and then using an old toothbrush to clean out the softened residue.I managed to save all but 3 brushes.
One brush in particular was very unusual.I found it laying at the bottom of the box in pretty sad condition;the brush hairs all twisted.It was made into a striping brush by using two round liners wired together and trimmed.By cleaning it and then soaking the hairs in dish detergent and shaping it until it was dry;then letting it set for a couple weeks and cleaning it out with warm water and re-oiling it,I managed to restore it's shape.It will stripe a line but not particularly well as some of the hair is still a bit distorted.I am enclosing a picture of the brush.
All of the stripers I've tried so far seem to perform very well considering they are all older than I am.I tried some experiments with a#4 striper and could pull a 1/4" line as easy as a 1/16th line.
One of the mysteries(to me anyway)is the tool shown laying on the inside of the top.It appears to be a set of hand made tongs.I was showing this to Keith Knecht awhile back and he theorized they may have been used to heat sizing over a flame.There are several small hand made cups in the kit that may have been used for that purpose.
Unfortunately Russ(Carl's grandson)could not provide any information about him as he died before Russ was born and he got the info he had from his mother who is not in the best of health.
So here they are;I will try and make two picture posts as I don't believe it can be done in just one.I hope they are enjoyed.

[Ray Smith]

More pictures.

[Ray Smith]

Last two.