Intro & Questions (about Screen Printing) mj

Doug Phillips · Post by **Doug Phillips** » Tue May 10, 2005 5:40 pm

Hello all, just found this board.

I have been in the business of sign making & tee shirt printing for 20+ years I had my own shop for a few years and for the past few have worked out of the house (love raising my son).
My hand lettering skills have been â€œokâ€ but I have recently developed a slight tremor in my right hand (probably too much mouse & tablet time) making it tougher on the smaller detailed stuff.
I am looking at expanding my capabilities to include gold leaf work, and was wondering if it can be done using screen printing methods? Can anyone shed some light on this or point me to some resources?
I purchased Kent Smithâ€™s book as a starting point, but it does not refer to any screening techniques.
I would most likely be limiting to glass work. I would also be interested in any resources on other glass techniques.
Thanks in advance for any help.
Doug Phillips
Denali Design Signs & Tees

Doug Bernhardt · Post by **Doug Bernhardt** » Tue May 10, 2005 7:20 pm

Hi Doug...am sure you'll find by doing a quick search on this site that all you dream of doing in glass is BEST done with screens. All you need is some dekkor back-up and away you go!
Best of luck

Doug Phillips · Post by **Doug Phillips** » Mon May 16, 2005 5:47 pm

D. Thanks for the response. Good news on being able to use screen techniques!
I did a search and didn't find what I was looking for, can you offer a few direct links to the appropriate posts?
I am interested in screening specifics like mesh counts, size consitency how to's, etc.

Thanks again,
Doug

Doug Fielder · Post by **Doug Fielder** » Tue May 17, 2005 10:41 am

Nothing on thread counts etc..., I would imagine using the finest you can get the ink through. But here is a link to some info that might be helpfull:
viewtopic.php?t=629&highlight=matte

Good luck.

I personally never screened on glass, but I am interested in learning, so I have been trying to gather as much info myself.

Post by **Mike Jackson** » Tue May 17, 2005 5:17 pm

Doug,
This is the kind of question that is hard to tackle in a post. Depending on how you look at it, screen printing is either pretty easy or darned hard and very complicated. Likewise, some people get away with very primitive equipment, but others spend a fortune on it. It is hard to be brief and yet give you enough information to be dangerous to yourself!

Screen printing has been around for a long, long time and there is no shortage of books and documentation on the subject. With that said, I haven't seen but a few scattered articles on the subject of using screens for glass work. All in all, it is much the same as printing on a solid enameled surface.

Here's a quick laundry list of the materials we used here.

Screens: 180 and 280 mesh. Mine are wooden frames from Sunbelt Screen 800-333-8412 Aluminum frames are better but cost much more. We use the 180 for asphaltum resists and the 280 for most screening. The larger the number, the finer the mesh.

Emulsion: NazDar Nazdisol Rapid Emulsion. There are many brands. Shelf life...around a year. You can also hand cut film and adhere using either water or laquer thinner. Consult your supplier for the brand names and numbers.

Exposure: Carbon Arc Lamp through a film positive for about 9 minutes at about 36" distance. I don't have a vacuum frame anymore, but they were nice. Commercial exposure units are available with the built in vacuum and exposure. Some states have outlawed carbon arc lamps. The fumes can be harmful.

Ink: Steven Parrish used NazDar Lacquer. We use Dekor on some projects and All Purpose Enamel on others. Sericol would work. We often used clear varnish for matte centers and it is possible to mix quick size in with the varnish for direct gilding.

Positives: You can hand cut rubylith or use a computer to cut it. We use a Gerber Edge2 printing with Jet Black foil on Edge Film Positive. You can also have film positives made at some service bureaus.

Table: I just use a half sheet of 3/4" MDO with the inexpensive screen hinges. If you do large work, you need a larger machine...One Armed Bandit?

Maybe others can add their info and choices, but that should give you an idea. I had a Step-By-Step in SC about a year ago with a glass piece I did for the Conclave. Anyone that attended any of Glawson's Conclaves would have seen the process a few times. Like I said earlier, it can be easy and it can be a real bear.

Use the Search feature on this site to find additional information on silk screening, emulsions, squeegees, inks and process.

Mike Jackson

Doug Phillips · Post by **Doug Phillips** » Tue May 17, 2005 7:28 pm

Thanks for the post Mike and the emails!

I'd like to add that Mike pointed out in an email that the [water] (added by MJ) size itself is not screened just the backing after the gold is layed [and dry]. Me being the rookie I am when i comes to gold issues had no clue, but this is the kind of info I need(ed).

I have been a screen printer for years so I am familiar with regular techniques used for vinyl inks & plastisols. I was assuming that the water based size was to be screened so I was curious about screen methods using water based products (still am now for other reasons).

Thanks, and feel free to add any relevant issues to this topic.

Doug

Sarah King · Post by **Sarah King** » Tue May 17, 2005 11:50 pm

Thanks for asking, Doug, and thanks, Mike, for the detailed answer - the kind of Sign Writing 101 type questions that some of us (like me) were too shy to ask.

Doug, I don't know about you, but I've found that gold leaf takes real manual dexterity - while Angel Gilding doesn't. You clean the glass, pour on the gold, pour on the silver, let it dry, screen print your design and clean off the extra gold. Costs less than half of what gold leaf costs, takes a quarter the time and is easier to learn. It's also pure 24 karat gold - not pretend.

Ok, I know - shameless self promotion - I would blush but I thought that Doug might be interested. www.angelgilding.com - a division of Stained Glass Ltd.

Post by **Mike Jackson** » Wed May 18, 2005 9:57 am

Doug,
Angel Gilding is another method, not covered in Kent's book (I don't think). It puts down a nice, even layer of gold. When everything is working right, it can be very fast and effecient. I'd suggest that you at least learn how to lay leaf with water and geletin. On our glass pieces, we used both techniques on the same sign regularly.

There is a TON of information on this forum about Angel Gilding. Just do a search.

http://www.theletterheads.com/glawson/anggildinst.html

Click the link above to see short videos of Rick doing a poured Angel Gild piece and then a sprayed piece.

Mike

Doug Fielder · Post by **Doug Fielder** » Wed May 18, 2005 11:37 am

Hi Mike, those clips are great, I never thought I would be interested in the Angel Gilding, but it looks like it does a spectacular job.
The sample in the pouring method was glue chipped correct?
Again, you should produce your films onto dvds so we all can purchase them and use them while reading along with the written directions. Also all the footage of the old-time sign painters showing their secrets etc. In this day and age of making videos on everything... Pinstriping made easy... etc... we could use some historic films to keep the craft alive too. As for the Pinstriping made easy, it is easy, it just takes a few years of practice to make it profitable.

Thanks again for sharing.....