Giusto Gilding

Jerry Berg · Post by **Jerry Berg** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 12:46 am

Here's the deal.

O.K., everythings giong as usual, I laid some white gold - no problem. Laid some 23k, no problem. These are both Monarch, and all of this is on the same piece of glass. A freind owed me so he gave me some Giusto Manetti 18k. This is all water gilded. This is all done back to back and I'm cruising along then comes the manetti.... This stuff is not being nice. I gild, let dry, then burnish as gently as possible and it wipes off. Gild again and it wipes off. 3rd time is not a charm. Dangnabbit!. I then made a new bach of size extra strength, no dice, nada. I feal like breaking out the Monark which I have but I'd like to use my Giusto garbage. (sorry giusto) What's the deal. I'm baffled here. What on earth could be the problem?

Jerry

Patrick Mackle · Post by **Patrick Mackle** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:07 am

Just a guess, but could it be that the Manetti gold is thicker or less porous that the Monarch? The Manetti may look shiny and dry because it is almost drying out, but it may need just a little longer to reach maximum adhesion before rubbing or burnishing. The fact that you mentioned that you added more size and it still did not stay probably even adds to the problem because it would take extra time to pass water out of a more concentrated amount of gelatin.
Pat

Post by **Danny Baronian** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 2:53 am

The problem could be the Manetti, how old was it? I've used it in the past with no problem, until a recent job.

Earlier this year I purchased some Manetti for a job, and had nothing but trouble through two packs. It started out fine, but after a few leaves, the sheets were torn or folded over with occasional voids or pinholes.

After the problem with Manetti, I ordered Ducati by Schwabacher. It handled well, had no voids or folds, and produced a beautiful gild the first time. The Manetti was thinner and fragile compared to Ducati.

Danny

Jerry Berg · Post by **Jerry Berg** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 11:31 am

I'm not sure how old the gold is Danny. It does'nt appear old at all. It was hard working with due to a lot of pin holes and sticking to the paper here and there. I will save it for surface gilding.

Pat, I did a final gild before I hit the hay and this morning same thing. It had a patchy matte look to it every time and just wiped off with the lightest touch. I could of been done with the job many times over. Oh well, it's interesting running into different problems, more for the learning. I enjoy this no matter what happens, the good and bad.

Thanks for the replies guys. I'll finish up with the monarch.

Post by **Danny Baronian** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 12:32 pm

Jerry, unfortunately time did not permit the exchange of the gold. The supplier would have replaced it without question.

If you are able, exchange it for something else.

That may be a problem since you are 'owned'.

Didn't catch that earlier.

Danny

Jerry Berg · Post by **Jerry Berg** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 4:40 pm

Ha Ha... I did'nt see that Danny. A big difference a letter can make. I fixed it.

Tony Segale · Post by **Tony Segale** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:20 pm

Jerry,

I've used Manetti a lot.
I don't-a understand-a.
My-a great-great-grandfather was a da-pope-a, and he sez to me,
"My son, you must-a always use-a Manetti. I a beat it, and I a blessed it, its always a gooda."

Since then, I've a always used it, behind a glass-a.
Here is a picture of my grandfather, tellin a me the story.

Kent Smith · Post by **Kent Smith** » Tue Dec 23, 2008 12:39 pm

I have found that with some runs of Manetti, the rouge is mixed with talc as an extender. That mix sometimes comes off with the gold more than usual and can contaminate a water size but not effect a surface gild. I takes very little to disipate into the size and cause much of it to lift. More gelatin will not help with this issue. It is very hard to see but a very light or pinker color of rouge paper can be an indicator.